Lying - Revision history

YitzchakSultan: Redirected page to Prohibition to Lie

2012-01-11T04:58:39Z

YitzchakSultan at 17:32, 2 January 2012

2012-01-02T17:32:05Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 17:32, 2 January 2012
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	# One should not be accustomed to lie for peace.<ref>Yam Shel Shlomo Mesechtas Yevomos 65b, Yad Eliyahu 62, see Niv Sefasayim pages 28-29. Refer to Lev Chaim 1:5. </ref>		# One should not be accustomed to lie for peace.<ref>Yam Shel Shlomo Mesechtas Yevomos 65b, Yad Eliyahu 62, see Niv Sefasayim pages 28-29. Refer to Lev Chaim 1:5. </ref>
	# One is permitted to say the food is good even if it is not to prevent the host from cooking a different food if you told the truth about the food.<ref>Titen Emes L’Yaakov page 104. </ref>		# One is permitted to say the food is good even if it is not to prevent the host from cooking a different food if you told the truth about the food.<ref>Titen Emes L’Yaakov page 104. </ref>
	# If children are fighting, and lying will bring peace between them it is permitted to do so.<ref>Opinions of Harav Shlomo Zalman Aurbach zt”l and Harav Elyashiv Shlita quoted in Titen Emes L’Yaakov page 85, Niv Sefasayim opage 26~~. Refer to Niv Sefasayim ibid if doing so is permitted when two non-Jews are fighting and if the truth is told it may cause damage to Jews~~. </ref>		# If children are fighting, and lying will bring peace between them it is permitted to do so.<ref>Opinions of Harav Shlomo Zalman Aurbach zt”l and Harav Elyashiv Shlita quoted in Titen Emes L’Yaakov page 85, Niv Sefasayim opage 26. </ref>
	# It is important to point out that when it is permitted to lie for peace one should not take it lightly and think that all cases are permitted one should really think if peace will be avoided by telling the truth.<ref>Refer to Niv Sefasayim page 26. See Torah L’shma 364:page 255 who says lying for peace is permitted if otherwise destruction would come about. </ref>		# It is important to point out that when it is permitted to lie for peace one should not take it lightly and think that all cases are permitted one should really think if peace will be avoided by telling the truth.<ref>Refer to Niv Sefasayim page 26. See Torah L’shma 364:page 255 who says lying for peace is permitted if otherwise destruction would come about. </ref>

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	==Broke a Utensil==		==Broke a Utensil==
	If a utensil broke and blaming it on a child<ref>Refer to Rashi Sefer Bereishis 30:23.</ref> (who does not understand, since otherwise it would not be good chinuch to lie) would make peace of the situation, then doing so is permitted.<ref>Titen Emes L’Yaakov page 125. </ref>.		# If a utensil broke and blaming it on a child<ref>Refer to Rashi Sefer Bereishis 30:23.</ref> (who does not understand, since otherwise it would not be good chinuch to lie) would make peace of the situation, then doing so is permitted.<ref>Titen Emes L’Yaakov page 125. </ref>.

	==Refraining from Issur==		==Refraining from Issur==
	In order to prevent someone from doing an issur one is allowed to say a name of an odom gadol (that he will listen to) who said it is ossur, even if the odom gadol did not say it.<ref>Refer to Rashi Mesechtas Pesachim 112a “hitla,” Orach Mesharim 9:6. </ref> The same is true to lie in order to avoid eating something which is ossur, i.e. to say you are fasting.<ref>Kaf Ha’chaim 565:36. </ref> ~~In addition, someone in the kashrus field may lie to a non-Jew and tell him Jewish law requires it even if it does not in order for him to listen.~~		# In order to prevent someone from doing an issur one is allowed to say a name of an odom gadol (that he will listen to) who said it is ossur, even if the odom gadol did not say it.<ref>Refer to Rashi Mesechtas Pesachim 112a “hitla,” Orach Mesharim 9:6. </ref> The same is true to lie in order to avoid eating something which is ossur, i.e. to say you are fasting.<ref>Kaf Ha’chaim 565:36. </ref>

	==Kallah ==		==Kallah ==
	There is a dispute if one is supposed to say to the chosson the kallah looks nice even if she does not.<ref>Mesechtas Kesubos 17a, Semak 227, Rabbeinu Yona Sharei Teshuva 3:181, Orchos Tzadikim Shar HaSheker, see Titen Emes L’Yaakov pages 175-176 who explains the dispute see ibid :page 100-101. Also see Niv Sefasayim 2:pages 4-9 in great depth, and Torah She’bal Pe 21:pages 92-94. Refer to Ben Yehoyada in Mesechtas Kesubos 16:page 67 and Yismach Lev 1:page 170. </ref> L'maseh, one is permitted to say a kallah looks beautiful even if she does not. The reason is in order that her chosson should love her.<ref>Mesechtas Kesubos 17a. See Tosfas “kallah,” Rashba, Shita Mekubetzes, Shulchan Aruch E.H. 65:1, Chasam Sofer Mesechtas Kesubos ibid.</ref> Some say this is based on the heter to lie because of peace.<ref>Ritvah Mesechtas Kesubos ibid. Refer to Maharsha Mesechtas Kesubos 16b “ketzad.” </ref> Others say because even if one says she is beautiful when she is not it can be going on her actions.<ref>Bais Shbmuel E.H. 65:2, Prisha 1, Aruch Ha’shulchan 65:1. See Shevet Ha’Levi 5:2. </ref> The same is true for one whose child is not pretty; he may say he is beautiful.<ref>Emes Koneh page 37:footnote 5, Titen Emes L’Yaakov page 224 quoting the opinion of Harav Shlomo Zalman Aurbach zt”l. </ref>		# There is a dispute if one is supposed to say to the chosson the kallah looks nice even if she does not.<ref>Mesechtas Kesubos 17a, Semak 227, Rabbeinu Yona Sharei Teshuva 3:181, Orchos Tzadikim Shar HaSheker, see Titen Emes L’Yaakov pages 175-176 who explains the dispute see ibid :page 100-101. Also see Niv Sefasayim 2:pages 4-9 in great depth, and Torah She’bal Pe 21:pages 92-94. Refer to Ben Yehoyada in Mesechtas Kesubos 16:page 67 and Yismach Lev 1:page 170. </ref> L'maseh, one is permitted to say a kallah looks beautiful even if she does not. The reason is in order that her chosson should love her.<ref>Mesechtas Kesubos 17a. See Tosfas “kallah,” Rashba, Shita Mekubetzes, Shulchan Aruch E.H. 65:1, Chasam Sofer Mesechtas Kesubos ibid.</ref> Some say this is based on the heter to lie because of peace.<ref>Ritvah Mesechtas Kesubos ibid. Refer to Maharsha Mesechtas Kesubos 16b “ketzad.” </ref> Others say because even if one says she is beautiful when she is not it can be going on her actions.<ref>Bais Shbmuel E.H. 65:2, Prisha 1, Aruch Ha’shulchan 65:1. See Shevet Ha’Levi 5:2. </ref> The same is true for one whose child is not pretty; he may say he is beautiful.<ref>Emes Koneh page 37:footnote 5, Titen Emes L’Yaakov page 224 quoting the opinion of Harav Shlomo Zalman Aurbach zt”l. </ref>

	==A Bought Item==		==A Bought Item==
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	==Learning==		==Learning==
	A rebbe who sees a student who is not learning, can tell him "you have the ability to learn better" even if the rebbe knows he does not, if it is done in order for the student to be more learned.<ref>Niv Sefasayim page 48. </ref>		# A rebbe who sees a student who is not learning, can tell him "you have the ability to learn better" even if the rebbe knows he does not, if it is done in order for the student to be more learned.<ref>Niv Sefasayim page 48. </ref>

	==Cheering Up Someone==		==Cheering Up Someone==
	One may lie to someone who is broken hearted if doing so will cheer him up.<ref>Emes Koneh page 37:5. </ref> For example, if one is in pain because he has no money one can say to his friend I do not either have money even if he really does.<ref>Niv Sefasayim page 73. </ref>		# One may lie to someone who is broken hearted if doing so will cheer him up.<ref>Emes Koneh page 37:5. </ref> For example, if one is in pain because he has no money one can say to his friend I do not either have money even if he really does.<ref>Niv Sefasayim page 73. </ref>

	==Calling Someone Son or Brother ==		==Calling Someone Son or Brother ==
	One is allowed to call someone his son or bother even if he is not his son or brother. The reason is because even one's students are his sons and all ~~Yiddin~~ are brothers.<ref>Orach Mesharim 9:10:footnote 12, Niv Sefasayim page 121. </ref>		# One is allowed to call someone his son or bother even if he is not his son or brother. The reason is because even one's students are his sons and all Jews are brothers.<ref>Orach Mesharim 9:10:footnote 12, Niv Sefasayim page 121. </ref>

	==Calling One's Son-in-Law a Son etc.==		==Calling One's Son-in-Law a Son etc.==
	It is very common after a couple gets married for the new father-in-law to call the son-in-law a son or daughter. This is not considered a lie because a son-in-law or daughter-in-law is really like ones own child.<ref>Refer to Titen Emes L’Yaakov page 143, Niv Sefasayim page 121, Rashi Sefer Bereishi 37:35 “v’kol,” Rashi in Mesechtas Shabbos 23b “nufek.” </ref> The same is true for the son-in-law to call his in-law by Ma or Ta.<ref>Niv Sefasayim page 121. </ref> Nonetheless, one should not do this in front of his parents.		# It is very common after a couple gets married for the new father-in-law to call the son-in-law a son or daughter. This is not considered a lie because a son-in-law or daughter-in-law is really like ones own child.<ref>Refer to Titen Emes L’Yaakov page 143, Niv Sefasayim page 121, Rashi Sefer Bereishi 37:35 “v’kol,” Rashi in Mesechtas Shabbos 23b “nufek.” </ref> The same is true for the son-in-law to call his in-law by Ma or Ta.<ref>Niv Sefasayim page 121. </ref> Nonetheless, one should not do this in front of his parents.

	==Exaggerating==		==Exaggerating==
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	==Yeshiva==		==Yeshiva==
	# It is forbidden to lie to the government and say that there are more students in the Yeshiva than there really are in order to receive more benefits from them.<ref>Igros Moshe C.M. 2:29. </ref>		# It is absolutely forbidden to lie to the government and say that there are more students in the Yeshiva than there really are in order to receive more benefits from them.<ref>Igros Moshe C.M. 2:29. </ref>

	==Imitating==		==Imitating==

YitzchakSultan: /* When it is permitted to lie? */

2011-12-18T20:07:32Z

When it is permitted to lie?

← Older revision		Revision as of 20:07, 18 December 2011
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	# The Gemorah<ref>Mesechtas Bava Metziah 23b, Shulchan Aruch C.M. 262:21, Magen Avraham 156:2, Pri Megadim Eishel Avraham 156, Mishnah Berurah 156:4, see Titen Emes L’Yaakov pages 41-59 in great depth. Some say this is only permitted once a year (Refer to Titen Emes L’Yaakov page 59). The Divrei Torah 2:67 says this Gemorah is talking about three areas where joking is done, starting off learning with a joke, Purim, and Succos. </ref> says for three things one is permitted to lie.<ref>Refer to Titen Emes L’Yaakov page 48 if doing so is optional or a mitzvah. Refer to Ben Yehoyada Mesechtas Bava Metziah 23b pages 70-70b who says these three things are said in a way which can be interrupted as the truth as well. The Machtzis Ha’shekel 156 says some say it is a mitzvah while others say one is allowed to lie in the above situations. </ref> 1. Lying regarding a mesechta 2. Lying regarding hilchos tznius. 3. Lying regarding a guest. There are different interpretations of what this means. Some say if a person asks you if you know a certain mesechtas one is allowed to say no since he is displaying humility.<ref>Rashi Mesechtas Bava Metziah 23b “b’mesechtas.” Refer to Niv Sefasayim 2:pages 35-37. </ref> If one asks you if you used the bed, you can answer no because of tznius.<ref>Rashi ibid “b’purya.” Refer to Tosfas “b’purya” Rambam Hilchos Gezeilah V’aveidah 14:13 and Rashba who have a different explanation of this. Refer to Igros Moshe C.M. 2:61:3. See Ben Yehoyada on Mesechtas Bava Metziah 23b for has a novel approach to what this question means. </ref> One may also avoid the truth for other middos as well.<ref>Niv Sefasayim page 58. </ref> Others say this means if one asks you on Purim if you know the difference between cursed Haman and boruch Mordechai you can say no.<ref>Maharsaha Chiddushei Agados Mesechtas Bava Metziah ibid “b’purya.” Refer to Titen Emes L’Yaakov page 52:26. See Moadim V’zemanim 6:109 who explains this opinion. </ref> One who is asked if his host treated him with respect can say no, in order that the host does not receive many unwanted guests.<ref>Rashi Mesechtas Bava Metziah 24a “b’ushpiza,” Tosfas Mesechtas Bava Metziah “b’ushpiza” Nemukei Yosef. Refer to Rambam ibid, Orchos Tzadikim Shar HaSheker. Shita M’keubetzes, Mieri Bav Metziah 23b. Some say this is all permitted because they are included in lying for peace (Titen Emes L’Yaakov page 43). The custom is always to say the food was good at a guest even if it was not, see Titen Emes L’Yaakov page 56:36. </ref> Others say when they ask someone a question on an inyun he can say he is learning a different inyun in order that they should not ask on the first inyun.<ref>Refer to Toras Chaim Mesechtas Bava Metziah ibid. </ref>		# The Gemorah<ref>Mesechtas Bava Metziah 23b, Shulchan Aruch C.M. 262:21, Magen Avraham 156:2, Pri Megadim Eishel Avraham 156, Mishnah Berurah 156:4, see Titen Emes L’Yaakov pages 41-59 in great depth. Some say this is only permitted once a year (Refer to Titen Emes L’Yaakov page 59). The Divrei Torah 2:67 says this Gemorah is talking about three areas where joking is done, starting off learning with a joke, Purim, and Succos. </ref> says for three things one is permitted to lie.<ref>Refer to Titen Emes L’Yaakov page 48 if doing so is optional or a mitzvah. Refer to Ben Yehoyada Mesechtas Bava Metziah 23b pages 70-70b who says these three things are said in a way which can be interrupted as the truth as well. The Machtzis Ha’shekel 156 says some say it is a mitzvah while others say one is allowed to lie in the above situations. </ref> 1. Lying regarding a mesechta 2. Lying regarding hilchos tznius. 3. Lying regarding a guest. There are different interpretations of what this means. Some say if a person asks you if you know a certain mesechtas one is allowed to say no since he is displaying humility.<ref>Rashi Mesechtas Bava Metziah 23b “b’mesechtas.” Refer to Niv Sefasayim 2:pages 35-37. </ref> If one asks you if you used the bed, you can answer no because of tznius.<ref>Rashi ibid “b’purya.” Refer to Tosfas “b’purya” Rambam Hilchos Gezeilah V’aveidah 14:13 and Rashba who have a different explanation of this. Refer to Igros Moshe C.M. 2:61:3. See Ben Yehoyada on Mesechtas Bava Metziah 23b for has a novel approach to what this question means. </ref> One may also avoid the truth for other middos as well.<ref>Niv Sefasayim page 58. </ref> Others say this means if one asks you on Purim if you know the difference between cursed Haman and boruch Mordechai you can say no.<ref>Maharsaha Chiddushei Agados Mesechtas Bava Metziah ibid “b’purya.” Refer to Titen Emes L’Yaakov page 52:26. See Moadim V’zemanim 6:109 who explains this opinion. </ref> One who is asked if his host treated him with respect can say no, in order that the host does not receive many unwanted guests.<ref>Rashi Mesechtas Bava Metziah 24a “b’ushpiza,” Tosfas Mesechtas Bava Metziah “b’ushpiza” Nemukei Yosef. Refer to Rambam ibid, Orchos Tzadikim Shar HaSheker. Shita M’keubetzes, Mieri Bav Metziah 23b. Some say this is all permitted because they are included in lying for peace (Titen Emes L’Yaakov page 43). The custom is always to say the food was good at a guest even if it was not, see Titen Emes L’Yaakov page 56:36. </ref> Others say when they ask someone a question on an inyun he can say he is learning a different inyun in order that they should not ask on the first inyun.<ref>Refer to Toras Chaim Mesechtas Bava Metziah ibid. </ref>
	# In the permitted instances of lying this applies for an un-learned person as well.<ref>Titen Emes L’Yaakov page 69 quoting the opinion of Harav Chaim Kanievesky Shlita, see Derech Sicha 1:pages 306-307. </ref> Based on the above, one who is asked where he is holding in a certain mesechta can say the daf before the one where he is really holding if he does not know that current Gemorah, but does know the previous daf. The reason is since he may be embarrassed if he is asked the Gemorah that he does not know.<ref>Titen Emes L’Yaakov page 175. </ref> It is important to point out the heter to lie about a certain mesechta is only if one is being asked in order to be tested, but if one is asked a din etc then one has to say the halacha.<ref>Tosfas Mesechtas Bava Metziah ibid, see Niv Sefasayim pages 51-52. </ref>		# In the permitted instances of lying this applies for an un-learned person as well.<ref>Titen Emes L’Yaakov page 69 quoting the opinion of Harav Chaim Kanievesky Shlita, see Derech Sicha 1:pages 306-307. </ref> Based on the above, one who is asked where he is holding in a certain mesechta can say the daf before the one where he is really holding if he does not know that current Gemorah, but does know the previous daf. The reason is since he may be embarrassed if he is asked the Gemorah that he does not know.<ref>Titen Emes L’Yaakov page 175. </ref> It is important to point out the heter to lie about a certain mesechta is only if one is being asked in order to be tested, but if one is asked a din etc then one has to say the halacha.<ref>Tosfas Mesechtas Bava Metziah ibid, see Niv Sefasayim pages 51-52. </ref>
	# In any situation where it is permitted to lie it is proper to avoid doing so.<ref>Orchos Tzadikim Shar HaSheker (end), Koneh Emes page 70:3. ~~</ref> <Ref> Some say~~ this is hinted to it the roshei teivos of the three above mentioned items. Ushpitza, Mesechtas, and Tashmish (tznius inyunim), in Hebrew spells Emes.~~<ref>Ben Yehoyada Mesechtas Bava Metziah 23b:page 70b. </ref>~~ </ref>		# In any situation where it is permitted to lie it is proper to avoid doing so.<ref>Orchos Tzadikim Shar HaSheker (end), Koneh Emes page 70:3. Ben Yehoyada Mesechtas Bava Metziah 23b:page 70b writes that this is hinted to it the roshei teivos of the three above mentioned items. Ushpitza, Mesechtas, and Tashmish (tznius inyunim), in Hebrew spells Emes. </ref>
	# A woman who is asked if she is pregnant may say she is not in order for people not to know her private business.<ref>Emes Koneh page 49:footnote 26, V’ein Lumo Michshal 2:psge 71.</ref>		# A woman who is asked if she is pregnant may say she is not in order for people not to know her private business.<ref>Emes Koneh page 49:footnote 26, V’ein Lumo Michshal 2:psge 71.</ref>
	# Based on the above, one is permitted to lie for humility, tznius and to avoid harm to one's friend.<ref>Refer to Lev Chaim 1:5, Torah She’bal Pe 21:page 90.</ref>		# Based on the above, one is permitted to lie for humility, tznius and to avoid harm to one's friend.<ref>Refer to Lev Chaim 1:5, Torah She’bal Pe 21:page 90.</ref>

YitzchakSultan: /* Origin */

2011-12-18T20:03:50Z

Origin

← Older revision		Revision as of 20:03, 18 December 2011
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	==Origin==		==Origin==
	# The posuk in the Torah~~<ref></ref>~~ says that one should further himself from lying. <ref> Parshas Shemos 23:7, see Rambam Hilchos De'os 5:7, Shulchan Aruch C.M. 262:21, Mishnah Berurah O.C. 25:14, Mesilas Yesharim 11. Refer to Rambam Sefer Hamitzvahs Lo Sasei 281 who includes the issur of lying in the issur of saying Hashem's name in vain regarding bais din. Lying is disgusted in the eyes of all, and there is nothing more disgusting than lying. Hashem is truth, and beracha only goes on someone who wants to go in the ways of Hashem. Therefore, the Torah tells us to further ourselves from lying. Pela Yoetz Sheker page 558, Sefas Tamim 6:page 24 write that no other aveirah does the Torah use the words "to further" except for lying therefore one must be careful with this even when it would only appear to be a lie. The issur is not only not to say a lie but to further oneself from a lie (Niv Sefasayim page 10). </ref>		# The posuk in the Torah says that one should further himself from lying. <ref> Parshas Shemos 23:7, see Rambam Hilchos De'os 5:7, Shulchan Aruch C.M. 262:21, Mishnah Berurah O.C. 25:14, Mesilas Yesharim 11. Refer to Rambam Sefer Hamitzvahs Lo Sasei 281 who includes the issur of lying in the issur of saying Hashem's name in vain regarding bais din. Lying is disgusted in the eyes of all, and there is nothing more disgusting than lying. Hashem is truth, and beracha only goes on someone who wants to go in the ways of Hashem. Therefore, the Torah tells us to further ourselves from lying. Pela Yoetz Sheker page 558, Sefas Tamim 6:page 24 write that no other aveirah does the Torah use the words "to further" except for lying therefore one must be careful with this even when it would only appear to be a lie. The issur is not only not to say a lie but to further oneself from a lie (Niv Sefasayim page 10). </ref>
	# The opinion of a few poskim is that this issur is talking about a person swearing in Bais Din,<ref>~~Eben~~ Ezra ~~Mishpatim~~ 23:7, see Orach Mesharim 9:footnote 1 in depth, Modanei Yom Tov 2:pages 463-464). Refer to Mesechtas Shavuos 30b. </ref> or if it might cause damage.<ref>Refer to Sefer Yeraim 235, Rambam Hilchos De’os 5:13, Derech Sicha 1:pages 306-307, 2:page 134. </ref> (According to this lying is permitted in many situations, see below), while most poskim<ref>Refer to Kovetz Bais Aron V’Yisroel 59:pages 70-75 in great depth. </ref> hold there is an issur even if the lying does not fall into the above categories.<ref>Refer to Semak 227, Shlah Shar Osios Shin, Chinuch ibid, Reishis Chuchma Shar Hakedusha 12:60, Shulchan Aruch Y.D. 402:12, Aruch L’ner Mesechtas Yevamos 65b “ko sumro,” Sefas Tamim 1:page 7, 6:page 24, Chofetz chaim pesicha asei 13, 1:1:1, Chazzon Ish Emunah and Betachon 4:13:page 55, Tzitz Eliezer 15:12:2, Niv Sefasayim pages 2-3, 2:pages 1-4. Refer to Michtav M’Eliyahu 1:pages 94-96 who explains what lying and truth are. </ref>		# The opinion of a few poskim is that this issur is talking about a person swearing in Bais Din,<ref>Ibn Ezra Shemot 23:7, see Orach Mesharim 9:footnote 1 in depth, Modanei Yom Tov 2:pages 463-464). Refer to Mesechtas Shavuos 30b. </ref> or if it might cause damage.<ref>Refer to Sefer Yeraim 235, Rambam Hilchos De’os 5:13, Derech Sicha 1:pages 306-307, 2:page 134. </ref> (According to this lying is permitted in many situations, see below), while most poskim<ref>Refer to Kovetz Bais Aron V’Yisroel 59:pages 70-75 in great depth. </ref> hold there is an issur even if the lying does not fall into the above categories.<ref>Refer to Semak 227, Shlah Shar Osios Shin, Chinuch ibid, Reishis Chuchma Shar Hakedusha 12:60, Shulchan Aruch Y.D. 402:12, Aruch L’ner Mesechtas Yevamos 65b “ko sumro,” Sefas Tamim 1:page 7, 6:page 24, Chofetz chaim pesicha asei 13, 1:1:1, Chazzon Ish Emunah and Betachon 4:13:page 55, Tzitz Eliezer 15:12:2, Niv Sefasayim pages 2-3, 2:pages 1-4. Refer to Michtav M’Eliyahu 1:pages 94-96 who explains what lying and truth are. </ref>

	==Listening to a lie==		==Listening to a lie==
	# One should not listen to a lie.<ref>Chinuch mitzvah 74, see Chinuch mitzvah 37, Chinuch mitzvah 74, Niv Sefasayim page 14. Refer to Minchas Elazar 3:18, Orach Mesharim 8:footnote 28, 11:6.</ref>		# One should not listen to a lie.<ref>Chinuch mitzvah 74, see Chinuch mitzvah 37, Chinuch mitzvah 74, Niv Sefasayim page 14. Refer to Minchas Elazar 3:18, Orach Mesharim 8:footnote 28, 11:6.</ref>

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2011-12-18T19:58:00Z

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